CB650R Loud/clunky shifts, getting stuck in neutral

[Goblin]

I installed the Racetorx Shift Support on my CB650R yesterday, and instead of helping with my false neutral it made my neutral a freaking 1.5th. Now I can't even shift from 1st to 2nd without saying hello to the neutral and I'm really flabbergasted because everyone else is praising this product. No it's not the shifting rod's position and no it's not the pedal's position. I can legit feel an additional clunk that prevents me from going from 1st to 2nd.

Did you check your chain slack ?

 

[EuroBadger]

Did you check your chain slack ?

Chain slack is pretty much out of equation since my bike is still new and fresh. Having said that, yes I checked the chain slack.

I also noticed that the thump when you downshift from N to 1st became awful louder and I can feel the ridiculously increased impact from the gear slamming in. It makes the bike jerk forward a bit.

 

[JRinKtown]

Chain slack is pretty much out of equation since my bike is still new and fresh. Having said that, yes I checked the chain slack.

I also noticed that the thump when you downshift from N to 1st became awful louder and I can feel the ridiculously increased impact from the gear slamming in. It makes the bike jerk forward a bit.

That is strange. I wonder if the support is binding. It could bind if:
The bolt location on your bike is off a bit, preventing the support from centering on the shaft.
Or you forgot to grease the bearings before install.
Also, did you remove and toss as instructed, the bracket that was attached to where the bolt secures the support? Just trying to think it out. Hope you find the reason.

 

[Goblin]

The Racetorx is nothing more than a support for the shifter rod, made out of solid aluminum with a needle bearing in it. If the bearing within the aluminum casing is turning freely and the alignment is correct with the shifter rod and installed correct (installation speaks for itself) it’s almost impossible that it is the Racetorx to be causing the problems. Maybe your shift problems are more noticeable now that you installed the Racetorx. Did your Racetorx aligned correctly on the shifter rod and Allen bolt, did it go on smooth without any friction? Just trying to figure out what the problem is

 

[Atucker]

If your bike is brand new the gears haven't yet had a chance to bed in. However, I would agree with @Goblin. Check your chain slack. What you describe sounds like its the chain

 

[EuroBadger]

That is strange. I wonder if the support is binding. It could bind if:
The bolt location on your bike is off a bit, preventing the support from centering on the shaft.
Or you forgot to grease the bearings before install.
Also, did you remove and toss as instructed, the bracket that was attached to where the bolt secures the support? Just trying to think it out. Hope you find the reason.

I double checked everything you had mentioned but couldn't find anything that seems off...

The Racetorx is nothing more than a support for the shifter rod, made out of solid aluminum with a needle bearing in it. If the bearing within the aluminum casing is turning freely and the alignment is correct with the shifter rod and installed correct (installation speaks for itself) it’s almost impossible that it is the Racetorx to be causing the problems. Maybe your shift problems are more noticeable now that you installed the Racetorx. Did your Racetorx aligned correctly on the shifter rod and Allen bolt, did it go on smooth without any friction? Just trying to figure out what the problem is

Knowing how simple and straightforward this gadget is, it is surprising how my bike changed overnight in the worst way imaginable. My Racetorx is literally doing exactly the opposite of what it is designed for.

If your bike is brand new the gears haven't yet had a chance to bed in. However, I would agree with @Goblin. Check your chain slack. What you describe sounds like its the chain

I have already checked the chain and there was no slack whatsoever. Also my transmission was just fine until I installed the supporter so I highly doubt it's got smth to do with the gears breaking in

 

[Atucker]

I double checked everything you had mentioned but couldn't find anything that seems off...


Knowing how simple and straightforward this gadget is, it is surprising how my bike changed overnight in the worst way imaginable. My Racetorx is literally doing exactly the opposite of what it is designed for.


I have already checked the chain and there was no slack whatsoever. Also my transmission was just fine until I installed the supporter so I highly doubt it's got smth to do with the gears breaking in

No slack whatsoever would be your problem. It should be between 1 - 1.25" free movement.

 

[EuroBadger]

No slack whatsoever would be your problem. It should be between 1 - 1.25" free movement.

I meant it did not have any excessive slack. My bike's chain is still almost new and you gotta understand that it was running fine til I put the shift support.

 

[Atucker]

I meant it did not have any excessive slack. My bike's chain is still almost new and you gotta understand that it was running fine til I put the shift support.

Well it doesn't take a genius to know that if you've only changed one thing and it was the shift shaft support take it off and move on. Lol. You'll know for sure in about 3mins of work if it was the problem.

 

[EuroBadger]

You'll know for sure in about 3mins of work if it was the problem.

Loosening the stock bolt that holds the U-shaped plate thing was such a PITA without a socket wrench that I can't imagine screwing it back now. So I am waiting for the new set of box sockets(and a wrench) I ordered to arrive tomorrow!

 

[EuroBadger]

I detached the Racetorx shift support then put the stock U-shaped thingy back on and now the bike is back to normal. What the heck. Knowing how simple the Racetorx is, I have a hard time understanding why it didn't work on my bike. I swear I did everything right when I had put the Racetorx on (multiple times again and again).

 

[shark650]

Very important, don’t forget to grease the bearings before install

 

[EuroBadger]

View attachment 11391
Very important, don’t forget to grease the bearings before install

Of course I did. Racetorx sends a pack of grease in the package.

 

[EuroBadger]

I detached the Racetorx shift support then put the stock U-shaped thingy back on and now the bike is back to normal. What the heck. Knowing how simple the Racetorx is, I have a hard time understanding why it didn't work on my bike. I swear I did everything right when I had put the Racetorx on (multiple times again and again).

Now things have gotten even stranger. I unscrewed the stock bolt(that holds the U-shaped plate in place) again to apply some thread locker, re-bolted it back, then suddenly the issue resumed. When shifting from the 1st to 2nd, the N blocks the dog from going into the 2nd and yoinks it into neutral.
Every single factor that can possibly affect the shifting is just fine - chain slack, shifter pedal's angle, grease on the Racetorx, clutch lever's bite point, shifter connecting rod's arm angle, etc.
I honestly do not understand what is going on and now just want to lazily blame Honda. How can this simple stuff can be so inconsistent and unreliable?

 

[Goblin]

Now things have gotten even stranger. I unscrewed the stock bolt(that holds the U-shaped plate in place) again to apply some thread locker, re-bolted it back, then suddenly the issue resumed. When shifting from the 1st to 2nd, the N blocks the dog from going into the 2nd and yoinks it into neutral.
Every single factor that can possibly affect the shifting is just fine - chain slack, shifter pedal's angle, grease on the Racetorx, clutch lever's bite point, shifter connecting rod's arm angle, etc.
I honestly do not understand what is going on and now just want to lazily blame Honda. How can this simple stuff can be so inconsistent and unreliable?

I think you need to go to the Honda dealership and let them figure out the problem

 

[miweber929]

Now things have gotten even stranger. I unscrewed the stock bolt(that holds the U-shaped plate in place) again to apply some thread locker, re-bolted it back, then suddenly the issue resumed. When shifting from the 1st to 2nd, the N blocks the dog from going into the 2nd and yoinks it into neutral.
Every single factor that can possibly affect the shifting is just fine - chain slack, shifter pedal's angle, grease on the Racetorx, clutch lever's bite point, shifter connecting rod's arm angle, etc.
I honestly do not understand what is going on and now just want to lazily blame Honda. How can this simple stuff can be so inconsistent and unreliable?

Can you move your shift shaft in and out at all? Like if you pulled out on the arm that attaches to the shaft does it have any movement to it? Even a mm or two. If you pull it out will it shift correctly again, then if you push it in does it shift poorly?

 

[shark650]

check if bearing are aligned and not trapped

 

[EuroBadger]

Can you move your shift shaft in and out at all? Like if you pulled out on the arm that attaches to the shaft does it have any movement to it? Even a mm or two. If you pull it out will it shift correctly again, then if you push it in does it shift poorly?

The shaft does move in and out like less than a mm but I have not checked if it affects shifting. Will try to find out today.

 

[EuroBadger]

Can you move your shift shaft in and out at all? Like if you pulled out on the arm that attaches to the shaft does it have any movement to it? Even a mm or two. If you pull it out will it shift correctly again, then if you push it in does it shift poorly?

The shaft does move in and out like less than a mm but I have not checked if it affects shifting. Will try to find out today.

I just remembered that the shaft moves in & out the same even when it's clamped by the surrounding arm. In this case the position of the shaft must be pretty much irrelevant since it's always moving.

 

[miweber929]

I just remembered that the shaft moves in & out the same even when it's clamped by the surrounding arm. In this case the position of the shaft must be pretty much irrelevant since it's always moving.

I’m not so sure of that hypothesis. It’s in and out, nit rotational or up and down.

The shaft should have some slight, and I mean slight in and out movement to it. A millimeter or so. If it’s more than that, it can cause shifting problems, I’ll go into it:

If the bike has been down on the that shift side, or if you’ve put stress on that shaft pushing it towards the “inside“ of the bike at all, you can damage the shift “keeper” that holds the shaft in place. If that shaft pushes in at all, the dogs won’t all align and you’ll have shifting issues. If you push the shaft in and have shifting issues, then pull it out and it’s better, that may be your issue. It’s really not a huge amount, I can’t stress that enough, to cause issues.

I damaged mine on my ~250 mile old CBR600RR when I bought a set of Woodcraft rearsets that had an incorrectly machined shifter arm that got stuck on the shaft when the clamp bolt broke off and I tried to drill the screw out. I barely stressed it, or so I thought, but I broke mine and the bike didn’t shift right.

The 650 series has the same system of a stacked transmission and high mounted shifter mech. Others have damaged theirs by dropping the bike, incorrectly torquing the splined arm or other seemingly minor things on both the RR and the 650 series. If you’ve done nothing you shop may have or Honda may have on the build.

It’s extremely unlikely you have have bad transmission, but not unheard of. It’s also very possibly it’s not the issue but it’s quick and easy to check, why I offered the info.