Scramblers

[Arthur45]

After a great ride in the sunshine on UK unclassified roads, it got me thinking about looking at a scrambler style of Has anyone got owner experience of a Triumph 400X or Honda CL500? Thanks.

 

[Redrocket]

Yes, I have owned my CL500 for over a year now. TBH it has become my "go to" bike. It's just so easy and comfortable to ride, solo. The 471cc Honda twin is one of the livelier A2 engines. It's a bit Jekyll and Hyde - plonks along but has a definite top end rush too. I've had approaching 40 bikes in my 50+ years of riding and this one honestly is one of my favourites.
Obviously it has its limitations. The suspension is budget and is soft. As I don't weigh much (70kg) for me it is better than other budget suspension that is usually too hard. The LED headlight isn't great. It has no rev counter - I have retro-fitted a little Japanese one that also has a volt meter. The other option is to fit a dongle to the ECU diagnostic socket that bluetooths to an app on a mobile phone - I have this too. Apart from fault codes it shows things like revs, voltage, and a load of other stuff that can be read while riding - just toggle between the app and navigation app. (This probably works on my CBR too; I haven't tried it). The CL has a slipper/assist clutch that is the lightest of any I have ever used.
$64,000 question - which of my two bikes will I change first? The CBR. I can't see me ever parting from my CL. It's just so versatile, easy to service and so much fun at reasonable speeds. Triumph 400 single? Nah, no real top end and has had issues.

 

[Arthur45]

Yes, I have owned my CL500 for over a year now. TBH it has become my "go to" bike. It's just so easy and comfortable to ride, solo. The 471cc Honda twin is one of the livelier A2 engines. It's a bit Jekyll and Hyde - plonks along but has a definite top end rush too. I've had approaching 40 bikes in my 50+ years of riding and this one honestly is one of my favourites.
Obviously it has its limitations. The suspension is budget and is soft. As I don't weigh much (70kg) for me it is better than other budget suspension that is usually too hard. The LED headlight isn't great. It has no rev counter - I have retro-fitted a little Japanese one that also has a volt meter. The other option is to fit a dongle to the ECU diagnostic socket that bluetooths to an app on a mobile phone - I have this too. Apart from fault codes it shows things like revs, voltage, and a load of other stuff that can be read while riding - just toggle between the app and navigation app. (This probably works on my CBR too; I haven't tried it). The CL has a slipper/assist clutch that is the lightest of any I have ever used.
$64,000 question - which of my two bikes will I change first? The CBR. I can't see me ever parting from my CL. It's just so versatile, easy to service and so much fun at reasonable speeds. Triumph 400 single? Nah, no real top end and has had issues.

Thanks. The only thing for me really is the looks. The tank line on the frame just reminds you it's base was the Rebel 500. But I think they might be bringing out a revised version. I'm alot heavier, but a test ride is the only real way to tell.

Like you I want something to hop on that's super light to use and will suit country lanes ( not green laning ) and B roads.

What issues have you heard of with the 400x?

I do like the CRF300 rally and NX500. Also looked at the Svartpilen 401. Very different bikes of course.

Perhaps I need a garage with a long line up!

 

[miweber929]

Triumph 400 single? Nah, no real top end and has had issues.

What issues? I’ve been following along with the model since it was introduced and all I’ve heard that was a legit model problem was the stalling on the early ones if you were too low an RPM when shifting which was solved by an ECU update. Lots of little “new rider” issues and people thinking a new $5k motorcycle should be top shelf component wise but otherwise for a completely new platform they’ve appeared to be exactly as advertised and very few problems.

 

[MacRoadster]

Wouldn't be great if the CL500 had the looks of the GB350S? 🙄

 

[Redrocket]

Stalling was the issue I recall re the 400 Triumph. It had been available in India for a while before we got it. In my view such an important new model should have been properly sorted before launch.

 

[Redrocket]

Thanks. The only thing for me really is the looks. The tank line on the frame just reminds you it's base was the Rebel 500. But I think they might be bringing out a revised version. I'm alot heavier, but a test ride is the only real way to tell.

Like you I want something to hop on that's super light to use and will suit country lanes ( not green laning ) and B roads.

What issues have you heard of with the 400x?

I do like the CRF300 rally and NX500. Also looked at the Svartpilen 401. Very different bikes of course.

Perhaps I need a garage with a long line up!

The 2025 was revised in a few minor ways - rider's footrest position and design was one, paintwork another. Certainly the motor is well-proven and trouble-free. Looks are subjective, but you don't look at the mantelpiece when stoking the fire....I like the CRF rally too, but really that's more focussed on off-road. Yes, n+1 is the number of bikes you want, where n is what you have.😛

 

[Arthur45]

I'll try and explain N+1 to my wife 😂

Need to book a few test rides. The 400x is just so we'll style.

The GB350s looks great but may run out of puff for me.

 

[miweber929]

Stalling was the issue I recall re the 400 Triumph.

OK, that was all I have seen, but saw a remap fixed it so it wasn't;t a huge deal.

It had been available in India for a while before we got it. In my view such an important new model should have been properly sorted before launch.

While true to a point, US and Euro emissions are FAR different than Indian emissions so that is not at all surprising and somewhat understandable that fueling would need an update.

 

[Redrocket]

They should have done it before releasing it; as you say, it is not altogether surprising. Nothing takes the edge off a new bike more than a fault that needs it to go back to the dealer to be fixed. Triumph is not alone in this but that doesn't excuse it in my view, however cheap it is.

 

[Redrocket]

I'll try and explain N+1 to my wife 😂

Need to book a few test rides. The 400x is just so we'll style.

The GB350s looks great but may run out of puff for me.

I tried one. It's a lovely bike that
compares more with the RE Hunter than the 40bhp singles like the Triumph, KTM etc. I found it OK to ride, with excellent suspension and brakes but I felt it needed a lower top gear. It's geared for economy but is do frugal anyway I'd pep it up through lower gearing. The seat height as a little too high for me; for its size it is quite tall compared to the RE 350 singles. Ultimately though, the CL can be bimbled around on just as well, but can also easily run at M-way speeds up inclines and against winds. The GB is a great little bike, but isn't for me.

 

[Arthur45]

Shame no one can comment on 400x ownership. But just need to ride a few. Thanks all.

 

[miweber929]

They should have done it before releasing it; as you say, it is not altogether surprising.

They did, however test riding 10 or even 100 test bikes is not like having thousands in the hands of various skilled riders in all temps, all climates and all uses.

Nothing takes the edge off a new bike more than a fault that needs it to go back to the dealer to be fixed. Triumph is not alone in this but that doesn't excuse it in my view, however cheap it is.

Must have never bought a first year of anything, then. My '14 650F (first year) had to go back for a defective starter relay, my '20 Tracer (second year, but more like 5th year since not a ton changed) had to go back for a faulty front brake switch and ECU update, my '17 Ducati Supersport (first year) went back for like 5 things that first year, my Jeep has had to have gone back for multiple recalls and TSBs...I can go on. It's just the way things are with so many sensors and gadgets these days. The 400's have been solid since that update, and everyone on the the Triumphrat.net forum that bought one seemingly raves about them.

I'm not saying you're wrong, and not trying to argue a point, but more saying it's hardly a model has "issues" having to do an ECU update, and certainly not something to bash a brand or model over. Honda over the years has had to rebuild motors over cam oiling issues, Yamaha had to redo fueling on their old air cooled triples in the 70's; it happens.

 

[miweber929]

Shame no one can comment on 400x ownership. But just need to ride a few. Thanks all.

Don't think anyone on here has bought one, sorry. I would suggest looking at Triumphrat.net in the 400 section to see what they are saying, that is probably the strongest Triumph forum on the 'net.

 

[MacRoadster]

The GB350s looks great but may run out of puff for me.

I think the GB350S would run out of puff for everyone that has experienced other bikes. 😄
That's why I think would be great if it had the 500 engine. Still low cost but with more useful power.

The 400X looks great too, but not sure if it's at the same level, quality wise, as the Honda's.

 

[Redrocket]

They did, however test riding 10 or even 100 test bikes is not like having thousands in the hands of various skilled riders in all temps, all climates and all uses.


Must have never bought a first year of anything, then. My '14 650F (first year) had to go back for a defective starter relay, my '20 Tracer (second year, but more like 5th year since not a ton changed) had to go back for a faulty front brake switch and ECU update, my '17 Ducati Supersport (first year) went back for like 5 things that first year, my Jeep has had to have gone back for multiple recalls and TSBs...I can go on. It's just the way things are with so many sensors and gadgets these days. The 400's have been solid since that update, and everyone on the the Triumphrat.net forum that bought one seemingly raves about them.

I'm not saying you're wrong, and not trying to argue a point, but more saying it's hardly a model has "issues" having to do an ECU update, and certainly not something to bash a brand or model over. Honda over the years has had to rebuild motors over cam oiling issues, Yamaha had to redo fueling on their old air cooled triples in the 70'

There is a difference between teething problems on an individual bike and those that affect all or most of a particular model. These days the technology involved in bikes and cars and the volume produced are bound to lead to occasional defects in any individual model of bike, whether a new model or an established one; I accept that. But releasing a new model with a fault that was apparent on several of the bikes tested in (I think) Spain when press riders had issues with the new bike and reported this in the press in my view is unacceptable.

This wasn't a case of first-gen technology issues like, say, DCT having glitches, it was a simple case of not sorting the stalling issue by a remap before delivery to buyers. I don't think this is acceptable, common practice or not.

You are right: I have usually preferred to buy the last-of line (outgoing) model; these are usually fully sorted, or as sorted as they're going to be. I generally let the pioneers come back and see how many arrows they have in their back before I buy a new model. I broke this rule with my CL500, a safe risk as the engine is well-proven is most of the rest of the bike, being based on the Rebel. I got badly bitten by ignoring my own advice when I bought a first year Moto-Guzzi V7 850 Special. That was a total nightmare. Anyone interested in the issues afflicted those should visit the forum on GuzziTech. Never again.

Anyway, I'm done with this. The roadster Triumph 400 is all over the place like a rash here. The scrambler version less so. Wanna be scene or herd? CL is much cooler in my view, ugly or not. A good twin will always beat a good single of comparable size. The CL has a larger engine anyway..

 

[MacRoadster]

The roadster Triumph 400 is all over the place like a rash here. The scrambler version less so. Wanna be scene or herd? CL is much cooler in my view, ugly or not. A good twin will always beat a good single of comparable size. The CL has a larger engine anyway..

There's many custom parts for the CL500 to improve it.
Starting by that huge exhaust...



and you'll have a better bike in the end.

 

[Redrocket]

Yes, the Japanese in particular have amazing custom parts. CL500 forum has loads of threads on exhausts etc. Few bikes remain bog standard for long; the bike, with no plastic fairings, is a really good blank canvas for mods. Some amazing stuff out there.